Terremoto in Giappone 11 marzo 2011: cause, eventi e conseguenze

[+Benito+]

Delle zeoliti so che sono igroscopiche, si usano anche in alcuni condizionatori (gli ururu sarara per intenderci) perchè appunto hanno capacità di assorbire l'acqua. Ignoro se abbiano altre funzioni specifiche e attendo anch'io un eventuale intervento di CE

[fendermexico]

Originariamente inviato da Dumah Brazorf

Ricordo che per l'"occasione" il governo (o l'organo preposto a 'ste cose) ha alzato il limite a 250mSv, se no di qui a un mese non ci sta dietro più nessuno alla centrale...

[Dumah Brazorf]

【No.1 Plant : Radioactive substances detected in the waters　】

▼From samples collected 30 meters north of the outlets of No.5-No.6 reactors at 14:20 April 14.
Iodine 131: 0.81 Bq/cc (20 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 1.0 Bq/cc (17 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 1.0 Bq/cc (11 times the limit)
▼From samples collected 330 meters south of the outlets of No.1-No.4 reactors at 14:00 April 14.
Iodine 131: 1.2 Bq/cc (30 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 0.79 Bq/cc (13 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 0.81 Bq/cc (9.0 times the limit)

the limit : the limit set for water outside the environmental monitoring area

【No.2 Plant : Radioactive substances detected in the waters　】

▼From samples collected near the outlets of No.3-No.4 reactors at 08:25 April 14. 10km south of the No.1 Plant
Iodine 131: 0.75 Bq/cc (19 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 0.88 Bq/cc (15 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 0.85 Bq/cc (9.4 times the limit)
▼From samples collected 7km south of the outlets of No.1-No.2 reactors at 07:55 April 14. 16km south of the No.1 Plant
Iodine 131: 0.84 Bq/cc (21 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 0.86 Bq/cc (14 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 0.87 Bq/cc (9.7 times the limit)

the limit : the limit set for water outside the environmental monitoring area

【No.1 Plant : Air dose 】
▼southern side of The main office: 500 meters north-west of the No.2 reactor
545 μSv/h Time:08:00 April 15,2011 Winds: easterly 1.5 m/s
▼near the West Gate : 1,100 meters west of the No.2 reactor.
36.6 μSv/h Time: 08:00 April 15, 2011 Winds: easterly 1.5 m/s
There was no neutron dose detected.

[marchigiano]

tornando all'idea di mettere i generatori diesel a 23 metri

http://www.ansa.it/mare/notizie/rubr...901396429.html



ripeto di nuovo: quali costi insormontabili saranno mai a mettere i generatori a 40mt invece di 23? vista anche la presenza di una collinetta dietro i reattori a meno di 500mt?

[xenom]

Originariamente inviato da david-1

In parole semplici, cosa può significare?
Sono a rischio di morte?

No non sono a rischio di morte, però hanno assorbito una bella dose...

[ChristinaAemiliana]

Originariamente inviato da david-1

In parole semplici, cosa può significare?
Sono a rischio di morte?

Originariamente inviato da Dumah Brazorf

Ricordo che per l'"occasione" il governo (o l'organo preposto a 'ste cose) ha alzato il limite a 250mSv, se no di qui a un mese non ci sta dietro più nessuno alla centrale...

Assolutamente no. I tecnici stanno lavorando a rotazione ed entro questi limiti non rischiano la vita. Il limite di 250mSv è un limite di emergenza (queste dosi provocano già brevi effetti ematici), ma niente kamikaze o suicidi.

Originariamente inviato da Dumah Brazorf

[Cristina's Home Door-Bell]
Cri che ci sai dire sull'uso della zeolite?
[/Cristina's Home Door-Bell]

Chi è?

Originariamente inviato da +Benito+

Delle zeoliti so che sono igroscopiche, si usano anche in alcuni condizionatori (gli ururu sarara per intenderci) perchè appunto hanno capacità di assorbire l'acqua. Ignoro se abbiano altre funzioni specifiche e attendo anch'io un eventuale intervento di CE

CA, non CE!

Avevo già accennato tempo fa a queste possibilità...

Originariamente inviato da ChristinaAemiliana

Per trattare l'acqua contaminata servono solitamente sistemi complessi (letti di resine, zeoliti...il cleanup di TMI è stato un buon banco di prova), ma ci vorrebbe un chimico, questo non è il mio campo decisamente...

... ma, come ribadisco, non si tratta del mio campo!

Al più, posso offrirvi QUESTO vecchio report di IAEA su TMI-2...è breve ma interessante, non contiene troppi dettagli tecnici e comprende foto e disegni che mi sembrano abbastanza chiari (di cui uno proprio sul sistema di decontaminazione dell'acqua).

ADDENDUM. Vi estraggo un pezzo abbastanza chiaro da una pubblicazione...

Contaminated water: Processes Considered



In considering the various processes for concentrating the radioactivity and decontaminating the water, several schemes that involved clarification of the water by filtration followed by either ion exchange, evaporation, or combinations of both were considered and were compared on the basis of the volume of wastes that would be generated and on the relative operating difficulties that would be encountered.

Most of you are familiar with conventional organic ion exchange resins: they have a hydrocarbon base and functional groups such as sulfonic acids or amines. These are the types of ion exchangers used to clean up the lightly contaminated waters in normal operations at power stations. By using both an anion exchange resin and a cation exchange resin, total demineralization of the water is obtained.

— If this type system were used, as in the first flowsheet, the amount of resin used would be large because of the large amount of sodium borate in the water. Also, the amount of resin needed would be large because it would be necessary to keep the concentration of radioactivity small, in order to avoid resin degradation from the absorbed radionuclides.

— in flowsheet 2, the resin degradation could be lessened if the radioactivity was eluted with sulfuric acid, but the acid containing the radioactivity would have to be evaporated. In nuclear power stations, evaporators are of the forced-circulation type and require frequent maintenance. This would be difficult when the evaporator contained large amounts of radioactivity.

— in flowsheet 3, direct evaporation, the same maintenance problems would exist plus the concentrate would contain all of the sodium borate.

— in flowsheet 4, an inorganic ion exchanger, an alumino silicate clay called zeolite, would be used to absorb the bulk of the radioactivity, and this material would not be degraded by the absorbed radiation. Here, an evaporator would be used to finish the decontamination and the concentrate would again contain all of the sodium borate; but, in this case, the concentrate would be low-activity level waste.

— in the last flowsheet, the zeolite would be used to absorb the bulk of the radioactivity, and organic ion exchangers would then be used to complete the decontamination.

It is this last flowsheet that was selected for concentration of the radioactive materials and decontamination of the high-activity water at TMI.

(Fonte: THE THREE MILE ISLAND ACCIDENT AND POST-ACCIDENT RECOVERY. WHAT DID WE LEARN? E. D. Collins, Chemical Technology Division, Oak Ridge National Laboratory).

[+Benito+]

Originariamente inviato da ChristinaAemiliana

CA, non CE!

Ops! Zorry! Ma anche tu, non potevi chiamarti Sandra?

[Dumah Brazorf]

【No.1 Plant : Radioactive substances detected in the waters　】

▼From samples collected 30 meters north of the outlets of No.5-No.6 reactors at 08:50 April 15.
Iodine 131: 1.9 Bq/cc (48 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 1.9 Bq/cc (32 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 2.0 Bq/cc (22 times the limit)
▼From samples collected 330 meters south of the outlets of No.1-No.4 reactors at 08:30 April 15.
Iodine 131: 0.72 Bq/cc (18 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 0.89 Bq/cc (15 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 0.88 Bq/cc (9.8 times the limit)

the limit : the limit set for water outside the environmental monitoring area


【No.2 Plant : Radioactive substances detected in the waters　】

▼From samples collected near the outlets of No.3-No.4 reactors at 08:40 April 15. 10km south of the No.1 Plant
Iodine 131: 0.66 Bq/cc (17 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 0.86 Bq/cc (14 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 0.87 Bq/cc (9.7 times the limit)
▼From samples collected 7km south of the outlets of No.1-No.2 reactors at 08:10 April 15. 16km south of the No.1 Plant
Iodine 131: 0.48 Bq/cc (12 times the limit)
Cesium 134: 0.58 Bq/cc (9.7 times the limit)
Cesium 137: 0.59 Bq/cc (6.6 times the limit)

the limit : the limit set for water outside the environmental monitoring area

【No.1 Plant : Air dose 】
▼southern side of The main office: 500 meters north-west of the No.2 reactor
535 μSv/h Time:08:00 April 16,2011 Winds: easterly 1.1 m/s
▼near the West Gate : 1,100 meters west of the No.2 reactor.
35.0 μSv/h Time: 08:00 April 16, 2011 Winds: easterly 1.1 m/s
There was no neutron dose detected.

[Dumah Brazorf]

Radioactivity rises again in sea near No.2 reactor

The operator of the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant says levels of radioactive substances in seawater have risen again near the water intake of its No.2 reactor.

The Tokyo Electric Power Company, known as TEPCO, says it detected 260 becquerels of iodine-131 per cubic centimeter in samples taken on Friday. That is 6,500 times the legal limit.

In the same area, levels of iodine-131 had been declining since April 2nd when 7.5 million times the limit was detected. On Thursday, the level was 1,100 times the safety limit.

TEPCO says the level of radioactive cesium-137 was also up in the same area. It detected 130 becquerels per cubic centimeter, 1,400 times the legal limit.
The firm also says that on Friday, radioactive iodine measured 30 kilometers east of the facility rose to 4 times the legal limit.

TEPCO has installed underwater barriers and metal boards near the intake to prevent contaminated water from leaking into the sea.

The power company says no new sources of leakage have been found.

Saturday, April 16, 2011 23:55 +0900 (JST)

[Dumah Brazorf]

TEPCO issues 6-9 month containment plan

The operator of the damaged Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant has issued a schedule for putting the crisis under control in 6 to 9 months.

The chairman of Tokyo Electric Power Company, Tsunehisa Katsumata, explained the plan at a news conference on Sunday.

The utility firm said a two-phase process is scheduled.
In the first stage over the next 3 months, it will build new cooling systems outside the Number 1 and 3 reactor buildings to cool down the nuclear fuel, and to ensure that radiation levels around the plant continue to decline.

The company says it will contain the radioactivity leakage from the Number 2 reactor by patching the damaged section.

In the second stage, TEPCO plans to lower the temperature of the nuclear fuel in the reactors to below 100 degrees Celsius to stabilize its condition.

The firm says the cooling will considerably lower the radiation levels in the environment around the plant.

The two-phases will be completed in 6 to 9 months.

The firm also plans to cover the reactor buildings with giant covers with filters to prevent the release of radioactive substances into the air.

It will also set up equipment to purify the contaminated water in tanks and other facilities.

At the same time, the company will increase the number of monitoring points within the government-set evacuation areas. It will use the data to neutralize the radioactive substances in soil and on buildings.

Sunday, April 17, 2011 16:35 +0900 (JST)


Inoltre il livello dell'acqua nel tunnel blablabla reattore2 continua a salire, centimetro per centimetro. Stamattina era a 85cm dalla superficie.
Altra notizia interessante: forse oggi manderanno in avanscoperta negli edifici dei reattori dei robottini americani per misurare le radiazioni e prendere delle foto (probabile si bruceranno un po' di pixel...). Fino ad ora nessuno è entrato in questi edifici a causa delle radiazioni.

[marchigiano]

figo sembra l'antenato di johnny five

[Bounty_]

Originariamente inviato da marchigiano

http://www.ansa.it/mare/notizie/rubr...901396429.html

Lì http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&sa...-8&sa=N&tab=wl
l'onda è diventata più alta perchè la costa ha un insenatura a forma di imbuto.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&sa...-8&sa=N&tab=wl

Da questa discussione, pag 154 http://www.hwupgrade.it/forum/showpo...postcount=3078

Originariamente inviato da Bounty_

l'altro parametro che ne può aumentare l'altezza, cioè la forma della costa
a Fukushima http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&sa...-8&sa=N&tab=wl
è piatta quindi ininfluente (cioè non è ad imbuto come la foce di un fiume)

Ciao

[Being]

novità?

cosa hanno combinato i robottini?

perché la discussione va scemando?

[fendermexico]

ma davvero un paese ipertecnologico come il giappone ha bisogno dell'america per avere in prestito qualche robot telecomandato dotato di 1 telecamera e 1 contatore geiger?

a vederlo dalla foto sembra uno di quei robot che in Italia gli ingegneri fanno per la loro tesi... per laurearsi...


aggiungerei pure...c'è voluto un mese per averli?

[Dumah Brazorf]

Foto non ne ho ancora viste ma il robottino ha misurato il livello di radiazioni, temperatura e % di ossigeno negli edifici dei reattori 1 e 3.



Temperatura (20-25°C) e ossigeno (20%) normali.

Robot measures radiation

The operator of the damaged Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant says the maximum radiation level inside the No. 3 reactor building is 57 millisieverts per hour.

Tokyo Electric Power Company used US-made remote-controlled robots on the 1st floor of the No. 1 and No. 3 reactor buildings on Sunday to measure radiation levels, temperatures and oxygen densities.

It announced on Monday that radiation readings were 10 to 49 millisieverts per hour in the No.1 building, and 28 to 57millisieverts per hour in the No. 3 building.

Exposure to the maximum reading in the No. 3 building for 4 and a half hours would exceed the emergency safety limit for nuclear power plant workers, set at 250 millisieverts.
Oxygen densities in both buildings were around 21 percent, high enough for workers to enter the buildings.

On Monday, TEPCO plans to use the robots to take measurements inside the No. 2 reactor.

Based on the collected data, the company will study what kind of work can be done inside the reactor buildings.

Meanwhile, the level of contaminated water in the tunnel of the No. 2 reactor continues to rise.

The level dropped 8 centimeters after about 660 tons of the highly radioactive water was moved into a turbine condenser.

But as of 7 AM on Monday, the water had risen again, to a point 9 centimeters higher than before the transfer.

TEPCO says contaminated water could be flowing into the tunnel since it plugged water leaks from a concrete pit outside the No. 2 reactor into the sea earlier this month.

It hopes to move the radioactive water from the tunnel to an onsite waste processing facility by the end of this week.

Workers at the plant have been looking for and fixing water leaks at the facility.

Monday, April 18, 2011 12:44 +0900 (JST)

[ConteZero]

Elevated levels of radiation have been measured inside the buildings housing the Nos. 1 and 3 reactors at the troubled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant, the nuclear safety agency said Monday.

The Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency suggested that the readings -- measured at between 10 and 49 millisieverts per hour for the No. 1 unit and between 28 and 57 millisieverts per hour for the No. 3 unit -- put time constraints on any work that must be done inside the reactors.

On Sunday, two remotely controlled robots measured radiation levels and other parameters inside the buildings. The plant operator, Tokyo Electric Power Co., has found it difficult to send workers inside them due to concerns that they may be exposed to high levels of radiation.

'na passeggiata di salute.

[ConteZero]

Originariamente inviato da fendermexico

ma davvero un paese ipertecnologico come il giappone ha bisogno dell'america per avere in prestito qualche robot telecomandato dotato di 1 telecamera e 1 contatore geiger?

a vederlo dalla foto sembra uno di quei robot che in Italia gli ingegneri fanno per la loro tesi... per laurearsi...


aggiungerei pure...c'è voluto un mese per averli?

Dovrebbe essere il classico robottino usato nel caso di ordigni esplosivi & co, probabilmente in versione leggermente "modificata".

Per il resto visto il comportamento del Giappone (hanno ammesso che sapevano che il disastro era a livello 7 sulla scala INES da subito, ma che hanno tenuto tutto "segreto" per un po'per evitare il panico) è facile che il governo abbia rallentato questo genere di controlli apposta... ed è facile che gli americani abbiano mandato il robot perché si sono rotti le balle di dover dipendere da fonti ufficiali che sono tutto fuorché affidabili.

[ConteZero]

Doveva succedere...

Prime Minister Naoto Kan on Monday touched on the need to freeze Japan's plans to build new nuclear facilities in the wake of the world's worst nuclear accident in a quarter century at the Fukushima Daiichi power plant.

''We will not proceed with the plans that have been put forward until now'' before the government completes a full examination of the accident and makes sure that nuclear plants in the country are safe, Kan said in a parliament session.

Before the crisis at the plant, triggered by the March 11 earthquake and tsunami, the government had set a target of adding 14 or more nuclear power stations by 2030 as part of its efforts to fight global warming.

Il Giappone (con oltre un mese di ritardo) ora pensa di smettere di costruire centrali nucleari.

[Dumah Brazorf]

Ritardo? Quale ritardo? Quello calcolato da chi non ha avuto niente a cui pensare nell'ultimo mese?

[xenom]

Originariamente inviato da ConteZero

Doveva succedere...



Il Giappone (con oltre un mese di ritardo) ora pensa di smettere di costruire centrali nucleari.

sarà bella da vedere... come mantengono accesa tokyo?

il fatto è che il giappone ha una produzione energetica e quindi un consumo colossale... se smantellano tutte le centrali nucleari dovranno rinunciare a tutta l'energia che sono stati abituati ad usare fino ad ora