[STAMPA ESTERA ] COMMENTI SULLE ELEZIONI ITALIANE

[Ser21]

Berlusconi Snatches Back Power in Italy

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/15/wo...5italy.html?hp

By IAN FISHER
Published: April 15, 2008

ROME — Silvio Berlusconi, the idiosyncratic billionaire who already dominates much of Italy’s public life, snatched back political power in elections that ended Monday, heading a center-right coalition certain to make him prime minister for a third term.
But with a bad economy and frustration high that Italy has lost ground to the rest of Europe, was unclear whether they voted for Mr. Berlusconi out of affection or, as many experts said, as the least bad choice after the nation weathered two years of inaction from the fractured center-left government.

While Mr. Berlusconi’s coalition won a convincing majority in both houses of Parliament, the victory came with much help from the Northern League, which advocates a federal system to favor the more prosperous north. The party caused Mr. Berlusconi’s first government in 1994 to collapse — a history that center-left leaders made clear in defeat.

“A season of opposition now begins against a majority that will have a hard time keeping together things that are difficult to keep together,” said Walter Veltroni, the former mayor of Rome and leader of the Democratic Party who ran against Mr. Berlusconi. “I don’t know how long this majority will last.”

The Democratic Party will now be the largest in opposition.

Mr. Berlusconi, 71, Italy’s third richest man and owner of a media and sports empire, did not make a victory speech. But in a brief phone call to a national television show Mr. Berlusconi, declaring himself “moved” by the victory, reached out to Mr. Veltroni to make reforms most Italians say are badly needed to get Italy moving again.

“We are always open to working together with the opposition,” he said. He will make a fuller statement on Tuesday.

The election — called just two years after Mr. Berlusconi lost to the now-departing center-left prime minister Romano Prodi — was considered one of the least exciting in memory, with many Italians doubting that either candidate could actually accomplish any meaningful change.

But in some basic ways, the election signaled a decisive shift in a nation whose politics have been unstable because of the involvement of many small parties with narrow interests. As head of the newly born Democratic Party — the merging of the two largest center-left parties — Mr. Veltroni had refused to run with far-left parties as Mr. Prodi had done.

As a result, the ANSA news agency reported that the number of parties in the parliament’s lower house, the Chamber of Deputies, would drop from 26 to just 6. On both the left and right, experts said — and in some cases lamented — the election showed a shift toward a more American- or British-style system of two dominant parties.

“It’s a Waterloo,” runs Tuesday’s headline in the moderate left daily Il Riformista.

Its editor, Antonio Polito, a departing senator from the now-defunct Margherita party, said: “The left is disappearing for the first time in history.” Referring to Mr. Veltroni’s party, he added, “The only party that managed to save itself after two disastrous Prodi years is a party that is modeling itself after the Democratic or Labor parties,” in the United States and Britain respectively.

Mr. Berlusconi’s spokesman, Paolo Bonaiuti, echoed the analysis. “Italy has rewarded a simplification of the political panorama.”

Elisabetta Povoledo and Daniele Pinto contributed reporting from Rome

Silvio Berlusconi wins third term as Italian PM

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle3744594.ece

As he acknowledged victory Silvio Berlusconi said Italy faces"difficult times"
Richard Owen in Rome

Silvio Berlusconi tonight headed for his third term in office after projections in Italy's general election gave him and his centre-Right allies an unassailable lead in the Senate as well as in the Lower House.

Walter Veltroni, leader of the centre Left, conceded defeat, saying "The Right will govern". But he said Mr Berlusconi owed his victory to his alliance with the separatist Northern League, which made an unexpectedly strong showing.

Mr Veltroni said he had telephoned Mr Berlusconi to congratulate him. "As is customary in all western democracies, and as I feel it is right to do, I called the leader of the People of Freedom, Silvio Berlusconi, to acknowledge his victory and wish him good luck in his job," Mr Veltroni said.

In his first comment Mr Berlusconi said in a phone call to a television election programme that he was "moved by the trust placed in me" and "ready for dialogue with the opposition" on reforms. He said Italy faced "difficult times", and his immediate priorities included a resolution of the Naples rubbish crisis and the future of Alitalia.

Official projections gave Mr Berlusconi and the centre Right 45.7% in the Lower House, or 340 seats, with 38.9% for Mr Veltroni and the centre Left, translating into 241 seats. In the Senate Mr Berlusconi's "People of Liberty" alliance was projected to have 46.8% to 37.9% for the Democratic Party, a fusion of liberals and former Communists, which if confirmed would give the Right 163 seats and the Left 141.

The result for the first time gives Italy a bi-polar Parliament dominated by Centre Right and Centre Left blocs, with several smaller parties excluded.

The last Government, a ten-party, centre-left coalition led by Romano Prodi, had a one-seat Senate majority and survived for only 20 months of its five-year term. Mr Prodi is bowing out of politics and has handed the leadership of the centre-Left to Mr Veltroni who, in a move designed to reassure many middle-class Italians, decided not to include the far-Left and the Greens in his alliance.

Analysts noted that the Northern League had performed unexpectedly well and would push for a powerful presence in any Berlusconi government. By contrast the Rainbow Alliance of Communists and Greens performed poorly.

Both Mr Berlusconi and Mr Veltroni vowed to cut taxes, reduce Italy's huge public debt and liberalise the public sector. A lacklustre campaign was enlivened only towards the end by Mr Berlusconi's reversion to typically extravagant remarks and promises. Most Italians weary of squabbling self serving politicians and chronic political instability turned out to vote with little enthusiasm.

Italians doubt whether the next government — the 62nd since the Second World War — will be able to reverse economic decline, stimulate investment, introduce deregulation and stem price rises for basic foods such as pasta and bread.

Symptoms of decline include the rubbish crisis in Naples, and the associated health scare over tainted buffalo mozzarella, as well as the faltering sale of the state airline AlItalia. Mr Berlusconi helped to undermine a bid by Air France KLM by advocating an "all-Italian" bid which has yet to materialise. One recent survey indicated that 51.4 per cent of Italians "feel worse off" today, compared with 36 per cent a year ago.

Mr Berlusconi, mocked by the Left for his efforts to disguise his height, age and receding hairline, has been implicated in a string of corruption investigations. He ran up a budget deficit equal to 4.4 per cent of gross domestic product (GDP) during his last period in office.

That made his victory all the more remarkable. At 71 he was written off by his critics as too old, too prone to vulgar gaffes, too wedded to vested interests and too dogged by corruption allegations to be the leader chosen by Italians to reverse the country’s economic and social decline.

Many will have been persuaded by the anti-Veltroni points Mr Berlusconi hammered away at in the campaign - that Mr Veltroni is a former Communist, that when mayor of Rome he posed with film stars but failed to tackle illegal immigration and urban degradation, but above all that he was associated with the government of Romano Prodi, during which Italy was overtaken by Spain economically and rubbish piled up uncollected in the streets of Naples.

It was a vintage hustings performance by Mr Berlusconi, who began as a cruise ship entertainer, made a fortune in property development in Milan and then in television before entering politics in 1994 to revive the centre-Right after the collapse of Christian Democracy and “save the country from the Communists”.

For many middle class Italians, fear and loathing of the Left proved stronger in this election than doubts about Mr Berlusconi and his more dubious allies such as the separatist Northern League. They forgave his gaffes in the closing stages of the campaign: his assertion that right wing women were more attractive than those on the Left, his description of Francesco Totti, the revered captain of AS Roma, as “out of his mind” for backing the Centre Left candidate for mayor of Rome, and his praise of a convicted mafioso who was once on his staff as a “hero”.

Mr Veltroni, who at 52 is 20 years younger than Mr Berlusconi, was thought to have closed the gap partly because of his effective performance on television and at rallies in calling for change and a break with the past, and partly because Mr Berlusconi's attempt to project a more sober, elder statesman image was undermined by characteristic gaffes on the last lap.

Mr Veltroni's chances , however, have been hampered by his Communist past, of which Mr Berlusconi reminded voters repeatedly. He also sent a campaign booklet to all households in Rome saying that, as Mayor of Rome, Mr Veltroni had failed to tackle illegal immigration and urban degradation.

But Italians know that — as one of his aides put it during the campaign — Mr Berlusconi tends to “say the first thing that comes into his head”. During his last period in power, from 2001 to 2006, he compared a German MEP to a “kapo” in a Nazi concentration camp, and suggested that the Danish Prime Minister should have an affair with his wife, the former actress Veronica Lario, because he was good looking.

He later had to apologise to his wife publicly for flirting openly with voluptuous television showgirls, offering to run off with one and marry another. When Tony and Cherie Blair visited him at his villa in Sardinia he wore a jaunty piratical bandana to hide a hair transplant. He told another visitor — Boris Johnson, then Editor of the Spectator — that Mussolini had been a benign dictator who did not murder opponents but sent them “on holiday” (that is, into exile).

After losing power to Mr Prodi in 2006 he refused at first to step down, alleging voting “irregularities”, and retreated back to Sardinia, where he staged a fake volcanic eruption during a fireworks party and was photographed with yet more showgirls from his Mediaset television empire. He denied he intended to form “the People of Liberty” from his Forza Italia and the Far Right Alleanza Nazionale — then proceeded to do precisely that after Mr Veltroni formed the Democratic Party.

During the campaign he referred to his short height (he wears stacked heels), claiming he was taller than either Vladimir Putin or Nicolas Sarkozy. The magistrates who have repeatedly invesitaged him for corruption, he said, should have regular mental health checks. Accused of failing to revive Italy’s economy when he was in power, leaving it with near zero growth and a huge deficit, he blithely deflected the blame onto Mr Prodi. In the campaign he waved the nationalist and protectionist flag, sinking the Air France KLM bid for the near bankrupt Alitalia by vowing to put together an all Italian consortium - which never materalised.

He has been mercilessly mocked for his cosmetic surgery and perma tan, his empty promises, his male chauvinism. Yet he bounces back — and although Mr Veltroni claimed Mr Berlusconi looked “tired” during the campaign he showed extraordinary energy and infectious optimism. He is still the dominant figiure on the Italian political stage while other European leaders - Tony Blair, Jacques Chirac, José Maria Aznar, Gerhard Schröder — have all gone.

The next stage, it is rumoured, is for him to stand for election as head of state. Many Italians, it seems, remain seduced by his promise to make them as rich as he is — and his entertainment value. What he has to prove however is that he can use his last term of office to do what he failed to do last time, and generate growth, raise productivity, encourage investment, tackle the crippling bureaucracy, nepotism and organised crime — and give Italy hope

Iniziano a disprezzarci e fanno bene.
Avanti così.

[Dobermann75]

Originariamente inviato da Ser21

Iniziano a disprezzarci e fanno bene.
Avanti così.

dici o e' qualche italiano a cui paice far disprezzare l'italia all'estero...

ti sei dimenticato quest'ultimo pezzettino:
"Elisabetta Povoledo and Daniele Pinto contributed reporting from Rome"

[Ser21]

Originariamente inviato da Dobermann75

dici o e' qualche italiano a cui paice far disprezzare l'italia all'estero...

ti sei dimenticato quest'ultimo pezzettino:
"Elisabetta Povoledo and Daniele Pinto contributed reporting from Rome"

KOMUNISTI!!

[ennys]

Iniziano a disprezzarci.

Iniziano...

[Ser21]

Originariamente inviato da ennys

Iniziano a disprezzarci.

Iniziano...

ci disprezzano da tempo,ora,questo disprezzo,è stato legittimato.

[fabio80]

assolutamente sì, avesse vinto veltroni sai che elogi

ma basta

[Ser21]

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

assolutamente sì, avesse vinto veltroni sai che elogi

ma basta

lo dicono loro,chiunque meglio di Berlusconi visto il CV del soggetto.

All'estero le notizie circolano per quello che sono,senza filtri.

Chissà perchè,proprio chi ha una visione chiara dei fatti senza i media locali ad inventare o offusacare,non voterebbe mai MrB.

Ma d'altronde il time di londra e quello di ny sono dei giornali faziosi e di sinistra,corretto ?

Ancora non ho letto un vostro commento sui contenti,sempre e solo sul contenitore...
Mi ricorda la strategia di qualcuno per non rispondere ai giornalisti

[fabio80]

Originariamente inviato da Ser21

lo dicono loro,chiunque meglio di Berlusconi visto il CV del soggetto.

All'estero le notizie circolano per quello che sono,senza filtri.

Chissà perchè,proprio chi ha una visione chiara dei fatti senza i media locali ad inventare o offusacare,non voterebbe mai MrB.

Ma d'altronde il time di londra e quello di ny sono dei giornali faziosi e di sinistra,corretto ?

Ancora non ho letto un vostro commento sui contenti,sempre e solo sul contenitore...
Mi ricorda la strategia di qualcuno per non rispondere ai giornalisti

commenti senza filtro e assolutamente disinteressati. ma ti risponderò come risposi tempo fa sul forum: darei il voto pure a satana pur di votare contro la sinistra. e questo è tutto

ps:

[Ser21]

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

commenti senza filtro e assolutamente disinteressati. ma ti risponderò come risposi tempo fa sul forum: darei il voto pure a satana pur di votare contro la sinistra. e questo è tutto

ps:

ok.
quindi te ne freghi di chi governi a dx,basta votare contro.
un po' quello che faccio io in maniera inversa

ma che ne pensi di berlusconi and co ?? brava gente ?
no perchè io un'opinione di ualter e del pd ce l'ho ed è molto negativa.(ho votato idv).

Tu immagino ne avrai una identica per belrusca,no ??

[neliam]

Ancora con questa stampa Stalinista .. ma allora i libri di storia non vi hanno insegnato nulla!! Meno male che li riscriveranno

<< NeliaM >>

[fabio80]

Originariamente inviato da Ser21

ok.
quindi te ne freghi di chi governi a dx,basta votare contro.
un po' quello che faccio io in maniera inversa

ma che ne pensi di berlusconi and co ?? brava gente ?

penso che siano meglio di satana , ma che avendo quelli non ho molto altro da fare

detto questo, te pensa, avrei pure annullato la scheda, ma l'elettorato sinistro del forum è riuscito a farmi inferocire abbastanza da fare un voto non per la destra, ma CONTRO la sinistra

e ti dirò, per stasera il vedere gente che continua con la schiuma alla bocca a vomitare insulti sulle intelligenze altrui, è uno spettacolo impagabile

poi nei prossimi giorni si parlerà di politica

[neliam]

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

ma l'elettorato sinistro del forum è riuscito a farmi inferocire abbastanza da fare un voto non per la destra, ma CONTRO la sinistra

Le elezioni sono diventate più una partita scudetto che una partita di responsabilità
Bha...che tristezza

<< NeliaM >>

[ennys]

Originariamente inviato da Ser21

ci disprezzano da tempo,ora,questo disprezzo,è stato legittimato.

Dal mio punto di vista, era più che legittimato anche prima.

[fabio80]

Originariamente inviato da neliam

Le elezioni sono diventate più una partita scudetto che una partita di responsabilità
Bha...che tristezza

<< NeliaM >>

risparmiati ste prediche, non attaccano

la sinistra intera campa solo per l'odio contro berlusconi, non accetto critiche da voialtri

[Ser21]

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

risparmiati ste prediche, non attaccano

la sinistra intera campa solo per l'odio contro berlusconi, non accetto critiche da voialtri

tu stesso hai detot che voti solo per l'odio contro la sinistra.
c'è qualcosa che non torna nei tuoi disocrsi...

[neliam]

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

risparmiati ste prediche, non attaccano

la sinistra intera campa solo per l'odio contro berlusconi, non accetto critiche da voialtri

Il pensiero politico non è una squadra di calcio, non si tifa! Voi, noi, loro, ma che discorsi sono??..bello mio viviamo tutti sotto lo stesso tetto e la gente che disprezza chi ha un pensiero politico diverso (che sia di destra e di sinistra) merita tutto il disprezzo
Argomentare e discutere una tesi è quello che manca; finchè si espongono fatti ed opinioni con superficialità non potrai che ottenere un risultato superficiale..
Benvenuto in Italia

<< NeliaM >>

[fabio80]

Originariamente inviato da neliam

Il pensiero politico non è una squadra di calcio, non si tifa! Voi, noi, loro, ma che discorsi sono??..bello mio viviamo tutti sotto lo stesso tetto e la gente che disprezza chi ha un pensiero politico diverso (che sia di destra e di sinistra) merita tutto il disprezzo
Argomentare e discutere una tesi è quello che manca; finchè si espongono fatti ed opinioni con superficialità non potrai che ottenere un risultato superficiale..
Benvenuto in Italia

<< NeliaM >>

1 - il disprezzo che ho maturato per la sx è una pura reazione, basta guardare in giro i commenti di sta gente stasera. io non porgo la guancia a chi mi reputa un idiota perchè non voto il loro m** di partito illuminato, al massimo posso elargire qualche randellata. il sinistro medio mi reputa un coglione? bene, e che si aspetta da me, petali di rosa? il muro contro muro non l'ho iniziato io, mi ci sono scontrato, ed adeguato. full stop.

2 - direttamente dal punto 1, con una simile situazione speri forse che io abbia voglia di intavolare discorsi?

[fabio80]

Originariamente inviato da Ser21

tu stesso hai detot che voti solo per l'odio contro la sinistra.
c'è qualcosa che non torna nei tuoi disocrsi...

cosa ti perplime?

[Ser21]

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

risparmiati ste prediche, non attaccano

la sinistra intera campa solo per l'odio contro berlusconi, non accetto critiche da voialtri

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

detto questo, te pensa, avrei pure annullato la scheda, ma l'elettorato sinistro del forum è riuscito a farmi inferocire abbastanza da fare un voto non per la destra, ma CONTRO la sinistra

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

cosa ti perplime?

La sinistra campa solo per l'odio contro Berlusconi.
Tu voti non per la desta ma Contro la Sinistra.

Mi spieghi qual'è la differenza ?

[waikiki]

Originariamente inviato da fabio80

assolutamente sì, avesse vinto veltroni sai che elogi

Walter Veltroni perlomeno è una persona onesta, una brava persona.
E sicuramente non ha amici mafiosi, non ha costruito la sua ricchezza grazie ad essa , non ha mai inneggiato alla mafia e corrotto giudici, ecc